electricity smart meters

[warmleatherette]

Gaz & Leccy

These surveillance machines are being rolled out
all over the country in the guise of supposedly
saving you money...
They can transmit data about when you are in,
the regular times you go out, what appliances you use....

If they try and force one on me I shall tell them to XXXXXXXXXXXXX

A privatised utility just wants people to save money. We can file that under 'obviously bullshit'.

Correct.
One thing that evades people with smart meters is the ability to charge different tarrifs at different times. There was an issue with this in the last two years and I'm not sure whether some legislation quashed it but it was highlighted on the Consumer Action Forum as something the energy companies wanted to implement. I've tried to find the post but can't but rest assured it exists.

No surprise in guessing when the most expensive tariffs will be or how difficult the bills will be to fathom out.

Personally I'm OK with everything not being smart as I really don't trust any of it. It's all spyware as far as I'm concewrned and none of it would have been brought in if some clever clogs hadn't worked out there's a bigger profit to be had using them.

I've still got the standard spinning disk meter and have no plans to change it any time soon.

These energy companies need to be under strict control as they have the luxury of operating as semi monopolies who can issue profits warnings when everyone has saved as much as they can and bump up the price. Few businesses can do this without the risk of outpricing themselves but they all seem to operate as a cartel so these lot can.

It'd be great to re-nationalise them but they'd be wrecked by militant unions, ran inefficiently or just used as a government fundraising cash cow if they weren't private companies so idealism aside we're stuck with them.

Why is it more likely to be wrecked by militant trade unions if it's nationalised? The same trade union laws would apply.

Remember a lot of our utilities are owned by foreign states so they're a (foreign) government cash cows now but the money is spent in other countries not here.

What's that got to do with smart meters, they don't go to every house and pull the fuse on every cable when there's a power cut, they shut the grid off just like they did in the 70's.

[warmleatherette]

Gaz & Leccy

These surveillance machines are being rolled out
all over the country in the guise of supposedly
saving you money...
They can transmit data about when you are in,
the regular times you go out, what appliances you use....

If they try and force one on me I shall tell them to XXXXXXXXXXXXX

A privatised utility just wants people to save money. We can file that under 'obviously bullshit'.

Correct.
One thing that evades people with smart meters is the ability to charge different tarrifs at different times. There was an issue with this in the last two years and I'm not sure whether some legislation quashed it but it was highlighted on the Consumer Action Forum as something the energy companies wanted to implement. I've tried to find the post but can't but rest assured it exists.

No surprise in guessing when the most expensive tariffs will be or how difficult the bills will be to fathom out.

Personally I'm OK with everything not being smart as I really don't trust any of it. It's all spyware as far as I'm concewrned and none of it would have been brought in if some clever clogs hadn't worked out there's a bigger profit to be had using them.

I've still got the standard spinning disk meter and have no plans to change it any time soon.

These energy companies need to be under strict control as they have the luxury of operating as semi monopolies who can issue profits warnings when everyone has saved as much as they can and bump up the price. Few businesses can do this without the risk of outpricing themselves but they all seem to operate as a cartel so these lot can.

It'd be great to re-nationalise them but they'd be wrecked by militant unions, ran inefficiently or just used as a government fundraising cash cow if they weren't private companies so idealism aside we're stuck with them.

Whilst I'm sure it's not to save "us" money, rather it's to save "them" money by not having to send a bloke round to read the meter, that's about it, we never had all this fuss about economy 7 did we?

[m4rkb]

Agreed. That's the most obvious use at first sight but don't forget these companies have a legal obligation to maximise their shareholders profits so you can virtually guarantee they'll be looking at extending the scope while relying on that as the best excuse.

Referring back to the article I couldn't find but will no doubt crop up at sometime , the suggestion was the tariff would be made the most expensive at peak times and the breakdown of the bill excessively complicated so no one other than those with a thorough understanding able to decipher it.

Fuck knows why everyone never took more advantage of Ecomony 7 back in the day but it did tend to complicate the wiring a bit with dual supplies. Being the cynic I am, I'd tend along the lines to think the modern energy companies are more interested in higher rates at peak times rather than the lower rates in the dead of night.

Either way Smart meters are not for me as my electric and gas companies both send emails or texts asking for the latest reading which does the same job of saving their man a visit - presuming I'm honest and tell the truth

[Ralph]

Come on Ralph. Militant union leaders not seizing the opportunity to plunge the rest of us into darkness if we don' meet their wage demands?
Bob Crow certainly knew how to call a strike at the right time with or without current laws. I'm all for fair employment conditions but we all know what would happen.

On your second point though, I totally agree. No way should these services be in foreign hands. They are all seen as 'safe bets' by their owners but the sad fact is we hardly own anything ourselves anymore.

Point is that's no more likely to happen if it was nationalised than it is now.

[birdie]

What are you saying there - " if you've got nothing to hide, you've got nothing to fear"?
They don't need to and have no right to spy on people without their consent.

How will they know if it's a kettle or a hairdryer?

By the power consumption of course plus the length of time you use it. I've had one for years, it doesn't trouble me unduly but the little box they give you so that you can monitor your consumption drove me potty within a week so I disconnected it. the only advantage is that you don't have estimated bills.

[m4rkb]

Come on Ralph. Militant union leaders not seizing the opportunity to plunge the rest of us into darkness if we don' meet their wage demands?
Bob Crow certainly knew how to call a strike at the right time with or without current laws. I'm all for fair employment conditions but we all know what would happen.

On your second point though, I totally agree. No way should these services be in foreign hands. They are all seen as 'safe bets' by their owners but the sad fact is we hardly own anything ourselves anymore.

Point is that's no more likely to happen if it was nationalised than it is now.

That's not a point because there's far more likelihood of a strike as soon as the union leaders get together. And I speak as someone who would dearly like to see these industries back in public hands for our own benefit but it will not happen because of leftist union leaders fucking it all up. If one were to enter back into public hands, fine. As soon as another does, their leaders will immediately collude to flex their muscles. Any more than two and were back to the seventies.

That's the mentality of how they work.

[birdie]

Agreed. That's the most obvious use at first sight but don't forget these companies have a legal obligation to maximise their shareholders profits so you can virtually guarantee they'll be looking at extending the scope while relying on that as the best excuse.

Referring back to the article I couldn't find but will no doubt crop up at sometime , the suggestion was the tariff would be made the most expensive at peak times and the breakdown of the bill excessively complicated so no one other than those with a thorough understanding able to decipher it.

Fuck knows why everyone never took more advantage of Ecomony 7 back in the day but it did tend to complicate the wiring a bit with dual supplies. Being the cynic I am, I'd tend along the lines to think the modern energy companies are more interested in higher rates at peak times rather than the lower rates in the dead of night.

Either way Smart meters are not for me as my electric andgas companies both send emails or texts asking for the latest reading which does the same job of saving their man a visit - presuming I'm honest and tell the truth

That works for the able bodied and sighted, neither of which apply to me, I can't bend down far enough to read it even if I could see well enough to do so, so if some twerp at t'other end knows whether it's the kettle or washing machine I'm using doesn't really bother me.

[m4rkb]

What are you saying there - " if you've got nothing to hide, you've got nothing to fear"?
They don't need to and have no right to spy on people without their consent.

How will they know if it's a kettle or a hairdryer?

By the power consumption of course plus the length of time you use it. I've had one for years, it doesn't trouble me unduly but the little box they give you so that you can monitor your consumption drove me potty within a week so I disconnected it. the only advantage is that you don't have estimated bills.

They want to connect everything up to the internet. And I mean everything. The data mining possibilities are fucking incredible.

The next generation of you household fuseboard is touted to be being Wifi enabled just like half the appliances you buy at the moment. Your modern wifi enabled hairdryer will report back to the fuse via radio signal what power consumption it's expecting to use and if there's a sudden unexpected change of power it will be chopped on the grounds there might be a problem. In the old days you worked out after a couple of blown fuses the thing was fucked and threw it away and bought a new one. Soon you'll need a technician with a special code only he and his company knows to reset the damn thing.

Talk about creating a false industry. If it gets any worse it'll rival the "training" industry New Labour created where you need a qualification to tie your own bootlaces before they let you on site.

[Ralph]

Come on Ralph. Militant union leaders not seizing the opportunity to plunge the rest of us into darkness if we don' meet their wage demands?
Bob Crow certainly knew how to call a strike at the right time with or without current laws. I'm all for fair employment conditions but we all know what would happen.

On your second point though, I totally agree. No way should these services be in foreign hands. They are all seen as 'safe bets' by their owners but the sad fact is we hardly own anything ourselves anymore.

Point is that's no more likely to happen if it was nationalised than it is now.

That's not a point because there's far more likelihood of a strike as soon as the union leaders get together. And I speak as someone who would dearly like to see these industries back in public hands for our own benefit but it will not happen because of leftist union leaders fucking it all up. If one were to enter back into public hands, fine. As soon as another does, their leaders will immediately collude to flex their muscles. Any more than two and were back to the seventies.

That's the mentality of how they work.

Why would they be more likely to "get together" or become more militant if it was nationalised. I'm not following this argument at all.

Any scenario you say could happen at a nationalised utility could happen now while they're owned by foreign governments etc.

People who work for the privatised utilities are free to join trade unions & presumably do.

The reasons the utilities will not be renationalised are a) Lack of political will. b) Lack of money.